On May 15, 10:17=A0am, ttk5...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
> On May 15, 8:06=A0am, "Chess One" <OneCh...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > <jkh...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
> >news:a81371eb-4be0-4468-9dcd-affd23852beb@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > "Alekhine's Parrot" (that quacking fowl Phil Innes) writes at the
> > _Chessville Weekly_:
>
> > "Coming up later this Year =96 Strongest ever US Tournament.
>
> > "September 19th to 28th sees a [so far] Category 15 tournament on US
> > soil in the 10 player SPICE CUP. =A0Seven of the 10 invitees have
> > already signed up, and I understand average Elo is currently 2600."
>
> > Question: Is it really plausible to claim that this tournament is/will
> > be stronger than New York 1927, or the 1st and 2nd Piatigorsky Cups?
> > ("Highest category" would be correct, but that's not what he wrote.)
>
> > ---
>
> > =A0 =A0 Im****tant News!
>
> > John Hillery thinks that any group of 10 US Players circa 1927
//average=
d//
> > 2600 ratings. =A0 :)))))))
>
> =A0 That is not what he is saying, Phil. By "US tournament," he clearly
> means "a chess tournament played on US soil," and not "a tournament
> limited to US citizens." The three events he refers to: New York 1927,
> and the two Piatigorsky Cups (Los Angeles 1963 and Santa Monica 1966),
> had only one or two American players each, out of six to 10 total
> contestants.
>
> > [quite apart from the fact that no ratings existed, even as
retrofitted
> > numbers against other players in the world, that is some might claim!]
>
> > Sometimes I don't know where his talents begin - somewhere on the
Yellow=
> > Brick Road? Anyway, now we know what the JKH definition of 'plausible'
i=
s.
> > It is indeed possible that he thinks 1927 players could average 2600,
an=
d
> > that is enough to write into these newsgroups, with disparaging
comments=
> > like a newbie or a follower of clan-Murray.
>
> > As a journalist, surely John Hillery will want to substatiate his
point =
by
> > mentioning even one fact; for example, a list of 10 players he
proposes =
to
> > average 2600 from 1927, would seem to me to be a minimum proposition
on =
his
> > part in order to be plausible.
>
> =A0 Here are the contestants at New York 1927, with their 5-year peak
> ratings as given by Dr. Elo in his book:
>
> Capablanca: =A02725
> Alekhine: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A02690
> Nimzovitch: =A0 =A02615
> Vidmar: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A02600
> Spielmann: =A0 =A02560
> Marshall: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A02570
>
> =A0 That's an average of 2627, which would ****ge it just into Category
> 16 (Elo 2626-2650). Probably a pretty reasonable estimate, perhaps a
> mite high -- with the exception of the oldest player, Marshall, these
> masters were all at or near their time of peak performance. So it's
> quite plausible to suggest that New York 1927 might be the strongest
> tournament ever held on US soil. It certainly was the the strongest up
> to that time.
> =A0 Checking the list of "the world's strongest tournaments" in Fox &
> James' "The Even More Complete Chess Addict" (Faber and Faber, 1993),
> we do indeed find NY 1927, and the two Piatigorsky Cups, given as the
> strongest American events, all at an estimated Category 15
> (2601-2625).
>
> =A0 If this Spice Cup tournament surp***** them, it will be quite a
> prestigious event.
Just for the sake of fuller information, here are the Patigorsky Cup
contestants, and their 5-year peak Elo ratings (or Jan 1978 rating
where Elo does not give a 5-year peak):
1963:
Keres 2670
Petrosian 2680
Najdorf 2635
Olafsson 2530 (as of 1/1/1978)
Reshevsky 2680
Gligoric 2620
Benko 2570
Panno 2580 (1/1/1978)
1966:
Spassky 2680
Fischer 2780 (1/11978)
Larsen 2620 (1/1/1978)
****tisch 2630 (1/1/1978)
Unzicker 2590
Petrosian 2680
Reshevsky 2680
Najdorf 2635
Ivkov 2570
Donner 2500
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